Music Biz 2.0: The Economics of Live Music Entertainment

Comment

Comment by Joh Padgett on July 14, 2009 at 8:32pm

I just heard last night about The Spin. That location has been a bastion of live music in Indy for decades. I really hope new ownership of that place will keep its history in mind when they decide what to do with the place. I also recognize the economics of the situation, live music venues in indy are having a very rough time in this economy. Hell they have a rough time even in great economic times.

Comment by Jon Silpayamanant on July 14, 2009 at 8:26pm

And, of course, the Music Mill is closed yet again. As is the Spin (formerly the Patio) in Broadripple.

Comment by Jon Silpayamanant on June 17, 2009 at 12:56pm

Yeah, David--I was told one thing when we agreed to play the Whammy Bar, but got another story after we played--don't need to get into the details here, but I hope they do get their old crowd back then it might be somewhat profitable to play there.

Comment by David Bagdade on June 15, 2009 at 4:28pm

Yes, it has indeed re-opened. I'm very happy about that. I'm somewhat less happy about the pay policy employed by the Whammy Bar for many of its shows...not wanting to get into public details, but I know, Joh, from your previous comments that you would be less than thrilled about it as well.

Comment by Jon Silpayamanant on June 10, 2009 at 1:48am

The Music Mill has opened back up and is trying to draw some of their former clientele back. We just played there last month (the Whammy Bar) and ha no idea what to expect, but apparently it just re-opened at the beginning of May--had I known that I might not have scheduled us there so soon after the re-opening.

Comment by David Bagdade on February 9, 2009 at 11:27am

Here's an update which might unfortunately be of interest. I mentioned in my earlier response that three venues on our circuit have closed. Since then, two more have closed (one, Sam's Saloon, sent an email this weekend saying their closing was effective immediately), and a third will no longer offer live entertainment, preferring instead to hold poker tournaments. Also, the Music Mill is going by the wayside as well. This contraction of venues will inevitably result in bands being pressured to play for less -- it's basic supply and demand. The number of buyers is steadily decreasing, while the number of sellers remains constant. Not good.

Comment by David Bagdade on January 2, 2009 at 4:44pm

Thanks for bringing these issues to the forefront, Joh. I look forward to your future contributions and to others' comments on this situation.

Comment by Joh Padgett on January 2, 2009 at 1:59pm

Excellent comment there David, the situation you refer to is the subject of an upcoming post on the topic of venues, the role of radio and local support for musicians which I will be writing on in the next few days here on Smaller Indiana. My Music Biz 2.0 series here is designed to provoke discussion amongst working musicians on SI and beyond to come up with a way to strategize how to improve our collaborative efforts to help support each other in the new business climate.

Comment by David Bagdade on January 2, 2009 at 1:45pm

Joh, your post raises a number of excellent points. I agree with your statements concerning cafe venues which pay little or nothing, and the undercutting effect caused by musicians who are willing to perform under these circumstances. However, I think the problem runs deeper than that. Many nightclub owners apparently feel the same way as the cafe owners. I have been playing live for thirty years, and I performed more than 100 times this past year. I can't tell you how many gigs I've done at bars where four bands split the take at the door. The problem in Indy is that there are many more bands than there are venues, and it's a simple case of supply and demand. If my band doesn't want to do a gig where we split $50 amongst four members, it's no problem for the venue. They'll find a band who will, and they'll have no trouble finding one. It was just as bad in Chicago when I lived there. My bands here have done a number of low-money gigs for the "exposure" or for other reasons. If we want to make money, though, we need to either hit the private circuit or find venues outside Indy, where the supply of bands is not so big and the market value is substantially more in the bands' favor. This is not just wannabes undercutting more established musicians (though I agree, Joh, that this is a problem). The process of paying dues requires that talented bands with pro talent and aspirations play fifty dollar gigs as (hopefully) a step in the process toward five hundred dollar gigs and beyond. My main band has been fortunate enough to be able to charge $600 to $800 for bar gigs where sound is provided and $800 to $1000 when we have to bring our own sound. Of course, we can only get that in Anderson, Elwood, New Castle, and so on...almost never in Indy, at least not in the bars. Moreover, this situation is probably on the way down, as three venues on our '07-08 circuit have closed. So I think your concern about the market for musical performance heading downward is highly valid, and for more reasons than you indicate in your well-reasoned post. Most club owners don't know the difference between a $100 band and a $600 band unless the latter band can demonstrate its drawing power. All things being relatively equal, which band do you think the venue will favor?